Gisborne Stakeholder Meeting 08 October 2003
Gisborne Cosmopolitan Club, 190 Derby Street
2pm to 4pm
12 Attended (Gisborne Tramping Club, QEII National Trust, Gisborne Anglers Club, Farm Forestry, DOC, Fish and Game, Forest and Bird, Gisborne Canoe and Tramping Club, MAF Policy, 4WD NZ)
Commentary
· There is a need for a code of conduct.
· Are you going to be consulting with local Maori?
· The reference to the Oreti River is an extreme example.
- There are marginal strips under the Conservation Act.
- Not a lot of rivers meander like that.
· The tramping club has a rapport with the farming community, have never been denied access.
- The club is not interested in a wander at will scenario.
- Concerned about paper roads being locked/blocked by landowners, preventing access to beaches and forest parks.
- Unless people have computer access, it is a problem knowing where public access/roads are.
- We have lost LINZ, no staff in the regions.
- No interest from Gisborne District Council.
· Under the RMA we already have district councils responsible for access.
· The council may have the available information, but it is a cost to the ratepayer every time the LINZ site is accessed.
- Why should people have to pay to get this information?
- Could people embrace this as a chance to get rid of what they do not want?
· Reference to the English way, with public footpaths and walkways through farmland.
- Respect of the land by the public.
- This is well marked and works well.
- But England did have at least 500 years to develop this.
- This is the case in Germany also.
· Is there willingness from the Government to fund access to adequately do the job?
· The Group is going a marvellous job, this is a difficult and emotive issue.
- This is non-confrontational.
- There are expectations now that access will be improved.
- Now we must move from the report to action.
- Cannot see a pathway.
- This is following on `the coat-tails' of Fish and Game.
· A person wants to make a helpful submission, but it is difficult to see what this means.
· Has the Group got suggested blueprints?
- It would be nice to have a Plan A, B and C.
· In this district we must safeguard what we already have.
- Several major cases here have been a real battle.
· A group raised money to survey a 9-14 kilometre long paper road into a national park.
- There was little support from DOC and local councils.
· The 1926 Taupo Act worked well, a good arrangement by the Crown and Maori landowners.
- Yet there could be a temptation by people to push their lawn down further and tell people to get off the lawn.
- This would not be the case if people knew their rights.
· The public may go to an area and see a locked gate on the public road.
- The public needs a system to be established so that people can legally get to an area.
- Access is usually provided where requested.
· There would be two arms to a national role: the availability of information, such as mapping and a Commissioner/Ombudsman for people with problems to appeal to when things are not being done.
- There is a problem of organisations not fulfilling their duties.
· The problem is of clarification, not access.
· Blocked gates can be overcome.
- Gates are there for implication/intimidation.
· Who is responsible for the marking of access?
- If it were on Crown land, would DOC be required to mark access and councils for beaches/reserves?
· It is hard to appeal to someone who wants to get rid of a road, even when it is not their legal right.
· In the Gisborne region, $40 000 has been spent on access signs by Fish and Game in the last 3 years, i.e. $300 per sign, not including the erection of the sign.
- There is an impact on the use of an area and on rights of access.
- Ongoing maintenance is required, some people tear down the signs.
· Contestable fund, importance of local ownership and negotiation.
· There is a need to get maximum use out of public lands now.
- It is important to know where they are in order to use them.
· Better processes are needed, i.e. rivers move, but access does not.
- There should be more retrospective legislation, because the idea was to provide access.
· People want reasonable, negotiated outcomes with certainty for the landowner.
· Deer hunters, trampers and other people on a farmer's land need to ask permission or they are trespassing.
- There is a problem when hunters and trampers try to access the land at the same time.
- Access has to be denied in a drought, fire risk.
- Problem of marijuana growing.
· In Gisborne, there is access to the hinterland that was pastoral farming but is now forestry.
- This is access for fishing and hunting.
- If there is a drought, access cannot be given, in particular to vehicles with their exhaust emissions.
- Even if people only want to get to the land beyond, they cannot.
- The face of the land is changing in Gisborne.
· The public has to remember that farms are businesses and that they have to be shut down every now and then.
· Pleased to see that there is no demand for the right to roam.
· It is rude if people do not request permission, as well as there being a danger of upsetting the relationship between landowners and users.
· Is a red herring being thrown in here in relation to access to property?
- Most landowners are happy to have people on their land if they ring up, and allow access with a sense of pride.
· Crown forest licensing is better now than it was in the past.
· Carter Holt Harvey manages a lot of Maori land, that is totally different.
· Reference to unformed public roads through a farmer's property.
- These can be a good deal to negotiate access, a bargaining factor.
· It can be difficult to find the landowner.
- People cannot go to Lands and Survey any more. There used to be a survey office.
- It is difficult to find databases.
This person is cautious, there has to be a trade-off between roads, problems and better access. ·
- Legally certain and in perpetuity.
· The answer could be in the failure of the current system to work, i.e. roads in grass and district councils not interested in trying to create access.
- They could be left to fight it out.
- Often there will be solutions already there.
· Regional councils did not work.
· Could the first step be the creation of a walkway agency with responsibilities in each area?
· The new Local Government Act expands the role of regional councils to look more at community values and aspirations.
- Broaden the funding base and responsibility by moving responsibility from district to regional councils.
· Should this be an agency outside of the Government?
- There is a need for certainty of funding; to get outcomes; represent public access; ability to go against authorities; and not add to bureaucracy.
- DOC is not eager to be involved.
- DOC is not having a fair go in getting access to land managed for the public.
- DOC should do more, as we own it and need to get access to it and use it.
· There is a marine reserve on the coast, but access by one area only.
- DOC states that the LGA is a stumbling block.
· Has the Group talked to foreign owners?
· People are unaware of where they can legally go, what is public, private land or who to contact.
- There should be a Commissioner for Access, not necessarily a government department.
- People want to know how they can get access in areas outside where they live.
· In local areas, clubs police access, but people do not want to join organisations these days.
- Club ownership gives more credibility, easier to deal with, compared to individuals.
Contact for Enquiries
Rural Affairs Coordinator
Sector Performance Policy
MAF Policy
Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry
PO Box 2526
Wellington
NEW ZEALAND
Phone: +64 4 894 0675
Fax: +64 4 4 894 0745
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